From ghpbou at orange.fr  Wed Aug  7 10:33:31 2024
From: ghpbou at orange.fr (=?utf-8?Q?Guilhem_Bourri=C3=A9?=)
Date: Wed, 7 Aug 2024 16:33:31 +0200
Subject: [OS X Emacs] Mac french keyboard
Message-ID: <1CBE71BB-5BFC-4446-A012-2E899F7C58CC@orange.fr>

Hello,

I use a french Mac key board.
I downloaded Emacs 29,4 x86_64-darwin18.7.0.

How can I obtain the backslash \ and {, } ?

The combination of keys Maj-Alt-/ conflicts in Emacs.

The command ?(emulate-mac-french-keyboard-mode t) in .emacs file does not solve the issue.

This is solved in Aquamacs by the option Meta & French.
But I would like to use Emacs too.

Best regards,




Guilhem Bourri?
ghpbou at orange.fr



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From christian at defun.dk  Wed Aug  7 11:34:02 2024
From: christian at defun.dk (Christian Lynbech)
Date: Wed, 7 Aug 2024 17:34:02 +0200
Subject: [OS X Emacs] Mac french keyboard
In-Reply-To: <1CBE71BB-5BFC-4446-A012-2E899F7C58CC@orange.fr>
References: <1CBE71BB-5BFC-4446-A012-2E899F7C58CC@orange.fr>
Message-ID: <AE20266E-C771-43ED-9A5B-CFFBCE38E6A4@defun.dk>

I assume that the problem is that you are using the Option key (in Mac parlance) as Meta key and thus pressing Maj-Option-/ invokes some command. This is at least the default on my machine, and pretty common.

One option is to rebind what the Option and Command key means to Emacs. If you add this to .emacs:

(setq mac-command-modifier 'meta
         mac-option-modifier ?alt)

you get the Command key to act as Meta and the Option key to act as Alt. Normally, no commands are bout to Alt so either you will get the default keyboard binding or you can at least rebind the desired combinations to insert the expected characters (I do not remember if Emacs grabs all keys or not). This I have done myself, both because I like my meta key to always be the key next to the spacebar and because on Linux, where Alt normally is Meta, one often gets in conflict with the window manager also wanting to use the Alt key.

Alternatively, you can rebind the keys as they by default appear to Emacs, but this may be an issue if you like those commands and can also be a bit of a chase because different modes may bind the same sequence to different things and you will need to fix all of the modes you use.

A third option is to rebind you keyboard to have the problematic characters on different combinations, but that will of course only work as long as you have you own specialised layout available. I have done so myself (not for conflict reasons but because there are certain keys I like to have easy access to) and have used the Ukulele application for that.

https://software.sil.org/ukelele/


/Christian


> Den 7. aug. 2024 kl. 16.33 skrev Guilhem Bourri? <ghpbou at orange.fr>:
> 
> Hello,
> 
> I use a french Mac key board.
> I downloaded Emacs 29,4 x86_64-darwin18.7.0.
> 
> How can I obtain the backslash \ and {, } ?
> 
> The combination of keys Maj-Alt-/ conflicts in Emacs.
> 
> The command ?(emulate-mac-french-keyboard-mode t) in .emacs file does not solve the issue.
> 
> This is solved in Aquamacs by the option Meta & French.
> But I would like to use Emacs too.
> 
> Best regards,
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Guilhem Bourri?
> ghpbou at orange.fr <mailto:ghpbou at orange.fr>
> 
> 
> 
> 
> _____________________________________________________________
> MacOSX-Emacs mailing list
> MacOSX-Emacs at email.esm.psu.edu
> https://email.esm.psu.edu/mailman/listinfo/macosx-emacs
> List Archives: http://dir.gmane.org/gmane.emacs.macintosh.osx

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From Peter_Dyballa at Web.DE  Wed Aug  7 15:15:16 2024
From: Peter_Dyballa at Web.DE (Peter Dyballa)
Date: Wed, 7 Aug 2024 21:15:16 +0200
Subject: [OS X Emacs] Mac french keyboard
In-Reply-To: <1CBE71BB-5BFC-4446-A012-2E899F7C58CC@orange.fr>
References: <1CBE71BB-5BFC-4446-A012-2E899F7C58CC@orange.fr>
Message-ID: <93205606-CEBC-4972-8049-5250883513D2@Web.DE>


> Am 07.08.2024 um 16:33 schrieb Guilhem Bourri? <ghpbou at orange.fr>:
> 
> The combination of keys Maj-Alt-/ conflicts in Emacs.

I am using a German keyboard, no remapping, and ??/ (Alt-S[hift]-7) (S-7 is /) gives the desired \. Just as in any other programme.

GNU Emacs 29 understands Unicode, and Apple keyboards or those built into a MacBook seem to produce Unicode ? at least it's that what the Key Codes utility (in AppStore or https://manytricks.com/keycodes/, where the Key Down event produces clearly a two bytes Unicode character) shows as being translated from the key's key code.

In GNU Emacs you can type C-u C-x = on a displayed character (including SPACE, TAB, NEWLINE, etc.) to determine its text properties. Possibly more important is C-h k. This allows you to compare what Key Codes sees and is translated into by your system and what GNU Emacs receives as translation of the key press or key release event.

--

Greetings

  Pete

"To infinity and beyond!"
				? Captain Buzz Lightyear


From jfenn at gmx.net  Wed Aug  7 16:46:32 2024
From: jfenn at gmx.net (Juergen Fenn)
Date: Wed, 7 Aug 2024 22:46:32 +0200
Subject: [OS X Emacs] Mac french keyboard
In-Reply-To: <93205606-CEBC-4972-8049-5250883513D2@Web.DE>
References: <1CBE71BB-5BFC-4446-A012-2E899F7C58CC@orange.fr>
 <93205606-CEBC-4972-8049-5250883513D2@Web.DE>
Message-ID: <b7d7a42b-ac8f-4061-8827-11ccc5f0e683@gmx.net>



Am 07.08.24 um 21:15 Uhr schrieb Peter Dyballa:
>> The combination of keys Maj-Alt-/ conflicts in Emacs.
> I am using a German keyboard, no remapping, and ??/ (Alt-S[hift]-7) (S-7 is /) gives the desired \. Just as in any other programme.

But this only holds true if you use a German keyboard layout. Switch to
French and you will see that the {} are mapped to the German opt+5 and
opt+? while the backslash is mapped to the German opt+shift+.

All in all, I think Christian's advice on remapping Meta will probably
do the trick.

Best regards,
J?rgen.

From Peter_Dyballa at Web.DE  Wed Aug  7 19:11:57 2024
From: Peter_Dyballa at Web.DE (Peter Dyballa)
Date: Thu, 8 Aug 2024 01:11:57 +0200
Subject: [OS X Emacs] Mac french keyboard
In-Reply-To: <b7d7a42b-ac8f-4061-8827-11ccc5f0e683@gmx.net>
References: <1CBE71BB-5BFC-4446-A012-2E899F7C58CC@orange.fr>
 <93205606-CEBC-4972-8049-5250883513D2@Web.DE>
 <b7d7a42b-ac8f-4061-8827-11ccc5f0e683@gmx.net>
Message-ID: <9E86D673-8005-4269-842A-2716BAF4C3E1@Web.DE>


> Am 07.08.2024 um 22:46 schrieb Juergen Fenn <jfenn at gmx.net>:
> 
> But this only holds true if you use a German keyboard layout. Switch to
> French and you will see that the {} are mapped to the German opt+5 and
> opt+? while the backslash is mapped to the German opt+shift+.

A French keyboard might produce different key codes and have different key caps in a different layout, in the end a programme will receive the proper chars (including control characters). The translation layer from hardware key code to software character can be changed by switching the keyboard language in Control Centre, so that German QWERTZ can become English QWERTY although you are still typing QWERTZ.

In case Guilhem is not used to the French keyboard layout it might help to open the floating virtual keyboard and see and learn which characters are actually hidden in the ? (alt/option) and ?? (shift-alt/option) key layers?

--
Mit friedvollen Gr??en

  Pete

We need a president who's fluent in at least one language.
			? Buck Henry